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  #9  
Old 02-01-2011, 12:28 PM
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He had another minor siezure last night. Its so scarey. He lets out the saddest little whine and then stiffens out a little. He also urinated on himself. The siezure lasted about 40 seconds and he then was a little disoriented for about a minute. 1 minute later he was wagging his tail and as happy as a clam.
When we went to the vet he told us he didn't know if the siezures were related to the heart murmur. Because he has no other symptoms I have to think they are related in some way. I thought the vet said he had a stage 5 murmur but my wife told me he actually said he has a stage 4 or 5 murmur. We are bringing him in for an X-Ray on Friday and they might start him on Aprasil. We are not feeding him Beniful anymore. My wife bought some dry Immes dog food at the pet store. She also bought him some salt free treats.
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  #10  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:23 AM
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I can relate to your situation with the heart murmurs. Back in the late 1990's I purchased 3 long hair chihuahuas. Mon, dad and daughter. It turned out they all had issues with heart murmurs (genetically). They lived 11,12 and 14 years. I went through this with each dog. I am also a pharmacist an can give you advice about the medications.

A few observations. It is possible that your dog is not having seizures. The vet expalined to me that more than likely the dog passes out because the heart is not able to pump enough blood to the brain. My dogs would do this after they ran up the steps. They would be out cold. 5 minutes later, you would never know that there was a problem.

Normally they start the enalapril once a day every day for the rest of the dogs life. If the dog contiues to have more frequent problems, they bump the enalapril up to twice a day. This is a heart med that reduces the preload pressure on the heart. It will slow the progression of the murmor. It also somewhat helps the heart pump more effiently.

The furosemide is a diuretic (water pill) that helps remove any fluid build up in the lungs. Because of the poor circulation, fluid can build up in the lungs. If your dog has coughing or gasping spells the furosemide will help, but it can be hard on the kidneys. In early stages of heart murmurs you use the furosemide on an as needed basis for a few days after an episode. As the disease progress you use it daily every day and sometimes twice a day. Your dog will pee much more often when on this drug.

There are two other drugs that can be used. They sometimes use digoxin, another heart med that improves heart function. It is normally only used in the later stages. None of my 3 dogs had this. There is also a drug that until recently we could only get it in Canada, but now is available in the US. The name escapes me at the moment. It is very expensive, but does show results. My last dog had this one.

I would do the x-ray but not the echo. X-ray will show how enlarged the heart has become due the murmur. My dogs all had very large hearts in the end. The hearts were so large thay it would pinch the breathing and eating tubes.

Reba (the daughter) only lived for 3 months after 1st symptoms. She was healthy as could be then one day she had an episode. She was gone 3 monthls later.

Chico (the dad) lived for about 6 month after 1st symptoms.

Carmel (the mom) did the best. She lived for 15 month after she showed symptoms.


I rather doubt you are in stage 5 with the symptoms you are having, but the x-ray will help determine the stage and medications to use.

With proper care, you dog can live along time. Please post back with any more info.
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  #11  
Old 02-02-2011, 09:57 AM
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also fish oil and co-enzyme q10 are good natural agents that help with heart murmurs.
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  #12  
Old 02-02-2011, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrfiero View Post
There is also a drug that until recently we could only get it in Canada, but now is available in the US. The name escapes me at the moment. It is very expensive, but does show results. My last dog had this one.
Vetmedin?

Vetmedin - New Treatment for Dogs with Congestive Heart Failure - Associated Content from Yahoo! - associatedcontent.com


-----

Last edited by Zippy; 02-02-2011 at 12:51 PM.
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  #13  
Old 02-02-2011, 12:49 PM
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Thank you MrFiero for that excellent and informative post!!
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  #14  
Old 02-02-2011, 11:50 PM
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Yes Zippy that is the one!

It can be useful when all other measures have been tried. It is expensive, but our little dogs are worth it. The give us
unconditional love for their entire lives and it's now are turn when they need
medical attention.
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  #15  
Old 02-03-2011, 03:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrfiero View Post
I can relate to your situation with the heart murmurs. Back in the late 1990's I purchased 3 long hair chihuahuas. Mon, dad and daughter. It turned out they all had issues with heart murmurs (genetically). They lived 11,12 and 14 years. I went through this with each dog. I am also a pharmacist an can give you advice about the medications.

A few observations. It is possible that your dog is not having seizures. The vet expalined to me that more than likely the dog passes out because the heart is not able to pump enough blood to the brain. My dogs would do this after they ran up the steps. They would be out cold. 5 minutes later, you would never know that there was a problem.

Normally they start the enalapril once a day every day for the rest of the dogs life. If the dog contiues to have more frequent problems, they bump the enalapril up to twice a day. This is a heart med that reduces the preload pressure on the heart. It will slow the progression of the murmor. It also somewhat helps the heart pump more effiently.

The furosemide is a diuretic (water pill) that helps remove any fluid build up in the lungs. Because of the poor circulation, fluid can build up in the lungs. If your dog has coughing or gasping spells the furosemide will help, but it can be hard on the kidneys. In early stages of heart murmurs you use the furosemide on an as needed basis for a few days after an episode. As the disease progress you use it daily every day and sometimes twice a day. Your dog will pee much more often when on this drug.

There are two other drugs that can be used. They sometimes use digoxin, another heart med that improves heart function. It is normally only used in the later stages. None of my 3 dogs had this. There is also a drug that until recently we could only get it in Canada, but now is available in the US. The name escapes me at the moment. It is very expensive, but does show results. My last dog had this one.

I would do the x-ray but not the echo. X-ray will show how enlarged the heart has become due the murmur. My dogs all had very large hearts in the end. The hearts were so large thay it would pinch the breathing and eating tubes.

Reba (the daughter) only lived for 3 months after 1st symptoms. She was healthy as could be then one day she had an episode. She was gone 3 monthls later.

Chico (the dad) lived for about 6 month after 1st symptoms.

Carmel (the mom) did the best. She lived for 15 month after she showed symptoms.


I rather doubt you are in stage 5 with the symptoms you are having, but the x-ray will help determine the stage and medications to use.

With proper care, you dog can live along time. Please post back with any more info.
Thanks for the response. I don't think Paco is passing out. He has always been laying down when he has one. Right before one starts he lets out a very loud very sad cry. Its the kind of cry you hear when you accidently step on one of a dogs paws.
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  #16  
Old 02-03-2011, 04:41 AM
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Very good info. Thank you for sharing your experiences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrfiero View Post
I can relate to your situation with the heart murmurs. Back in the late 1990's I purchased 3 long hair chihuahuas. Mon, dad and daughter. It turned out they all had issues with heart murmurs (genetically). They lived 11,12 and 14 years. I went through this with each dog. I am also a pharmacist an can give you advice about the medications.

A few observations. It is possible that your dog is not having seizures. The vet expalined to me that more than likely the dog passes out because the heart is not able to pump enough blood to the brain. My dogs would do this after they ran up the steps. They would be out cold. 5 minutes later, you would never know that there was a problem.

Normally they start the enalapril once a day every day for the rest of the dogs life. If the dog contiues to have more frequent problems, they bump the enalapril up to twice a day. This is a heart med that reduces the preload pressure on the heart. It will slow the progression of the murmor. It also somewhat helps the heart pump more effiently.

The furosemide is a diuretic (water pill) that helps remove any fluid build up in the lungs. Because of the poor circulation, fluid can build up in the lungs. If your dog has coughing or gasping spells the furosemide will help, but it can be hard on the kidneys. In early stages of heart murmurs you use the furosemide on an as needed basis for a few days after an episode. As the disease progress you use it daily every day and sometimes twice a day. Your dog will pee much more often when on this drug.

There are two other drugs that can be used. They sometimes use digoxin, another heart med that improves heart function. It is normally only used in the later stages. None of my 3 dogs had this. There is also a drug that until recently we could only get it in Canada, but now is available in the US. The name escapes me at the moment. It is very expensive, but does show results. My last dog had this one.

I would do the x-ray but not the echo. X-ray will show how enlarged the heart has become due the murmur. My dogs all had very large hearts in the end. The hearts were so large thay it would pinch the breathing and eating tubes.

Reba (the daughter) only lived for 3 months after 1st symptoms. She was healthy as could be then one day she had an episode. She was gone 3 monthls later.

Chico (the dad) lived for about 6 month after 1st symptoms.

Carmel (the mom) did the best. She lived for 15 month after she showed symptoms.


I rather doubt you are in stage 5 with the symptoms you are having, but the x-ray will help determine the stage and medications to use.

With proper care, you dog can live along time. Please post back with any more info.
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