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As some know we fed raw for 5 1/2mo until the end of August. After issues with Mari's intolerences of certain meat sources (which totally stressed me out), lack of variety locally & getting the "look" of the hubs about how much we were spending in dog food monthly because I was ordering a lot online--I wanted to see if I could find an alternative that helped with all of the issues.

Anyway, long story short we tried ZiwiPeak & then added in 1 meal of Honest Kitchen a day & while I love ZiwiPeak it cost the same to feed primarily that as it does to get chicken locally (being the only meat that is priced decently around here) & ordering other sources online from hare-today. Go figure! The Honest Kitchen, while a great food & worlds better than any kibble (IMO), we started seeing some unpleasant changes in the pups I'm assuming because of the added fruits/veggies. Marley began to eat poo :roll: , the pups are getting a bit stinkier after a few weeks of a bath (I didn't expect that from just fruits & veggies?), their eyes are a bit more watery (though no staining) & whether it was related or not Mari had a tiny issue with fleas a few weeks after starting HK. Sure we've had a BAD year for fleas in our area...but when on raw during the summer they were constanly laying in the grass outside eating their boney meals & never had an issue.

Another "issue" with raw that was stressing me out was the time I was spending preparing, feeding & cleaning up meals for the six Chi's. So this time, while some may not agree, I'm going to be feeding mainly meat/bone/organ grinds and keep feeding the chicken backs I already have plus I'll continue to get some necks, split breasts, cornish hens, etc locally so they get their chewing/dental benefits in a couple times a week.

So I'm pretty psyched about the switch! :D I ordered 37lbs of grinds from hare-today so I expect to get them next Wednesday. We're nearing the end of our box of HK & the bag of ZP we have. I do have a few raw items left from before too in case we run out. ;) Thanks for letting me share - I'm pretty excited if you can't tell. LOL
 

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Heather - I am beyond excited too!! I think that's awesome. What a journey you have had. I really enjoyed reading your post as I have followed your food choices for a long time and I think you are a great Chi mom. It was interesting for me to read the choices you made with THK and the Ziwi, which I think are excellent. But going back to full time raw made my day!! :)

I think the grinds from hare-today are great. I have no problem with them, especially for experienced raw feeders because you know how and when to add in the RMB to supplement for teeth cleaning and mental health. I think it's the best of both worlds.

I have seen the benefits too....... no doggy odor, clean teeth, fresh breath, small stools, beautiful body condition, etc. I can't imagine going back to kibble, but I do think that Ziwi and THK are great choices and I'm glad we have those to fall back on if needed.

Interesting about the fleas. I have heard that a raw fed dog is very unattractive to parasites and that proves it. I have never seen a flea on Brody.

Anyway, thanks for the great post! I'm anxious to hear what you think of the different grinds. I am out of the tripe and was planning to order another chub and will get some grinds also with my next order. I want to try goat for sure. Lisa said her pups really like that one. Keep me posted on the different grinds you are trying and let me know which ones are the favorites.
 

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That is awesome. We have a local place (about an hour & 1/2 away) that does grinds, I just haven't gotten any yet. Once a month they deliver to a city that's about 1/2 hour away from me, so I am looking forward to try it.
 

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Wooohoooo that's fab I wish we had grinds like that here!!

I'm really open to new things with my dogs but seeing u go back just tells me don't change lol
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Wooohoooo that's fab I wish we had grinds like that here!!

I'm really open to new things with my dogs but seeing u go back just tells me don't change lol
Nah, you're doing a great job & I wouldn't change. Though we are going to keep some ZP on hand "just in case". ;) But I think you already are doing that as well. LOL


That is awesome. We have a local place (about an hour & 1/2 away) that does grinds, I just haven't gotten any yet. Once a month they deliver to a city that's about 1/2 hour away from me, so I am looking forward to try it.
Oh you are SO lucky!! We have a place a few hours away is a "doggy butcher" (though I don't think they do grinds) but I don't know if I would really want to make that trip so often. I really love the hare-today however if they were closer I'd love to save the $25 in shipping every time. LOL


Heather - I am beyond excited too!! I think that's awesome. What a journey you have had. I really enjoyed reading your post as I have followed your food choices for a long time and I think you are a great Chi mom. It was interesting for me to read the choices you made with THK and the Ziwi, which I think are excellent. But going back to full time raw made my day!! :)

I think the grinds from hare-today are great. I have no problem with them, especially for experienced raw feeders because you know how and when to add in the RMB to supplement for teeth cleaning and mental health. I think it's the best of both worlds.

I have seen the benefits too....... no doggy odor, clean teeth, fresh breath, small stools, beautiful body condition, etc. I can't imagine going back to kibble, but I do think that Ziwi and THK are great choices and I'm glad we have those to fall back on if needed.

Interesting about the fleas. I have heard that a raw fed dog is very unattractive to parasites and that proves it. I have never seen a flea on Brody.

Anyway, thanks for the great post! I'm anxious to hear what you think of the different grinds. I am out of the tripe and was planning to order another chub and will get some grinds also with my next order. I want to try goat for sure. Lisa said her pups really like that one. Keep me posted on the different grinds you are trying and let me know which ones are the favorites.
Thanks for your kind words Tracy! I do feel a bit "guilty" for doing the grinds because there was a time when I wanted to do full prey model raw. Honestly, the two reason that I don't want to do that anymore is 1)it is time consuming for me & while I love that my dogs enjoy it I really need to be realistic with my schedule & 2)Marley & Maya scare the crap out of me when eating their bone in meals! Marley still will swallow pieces too large & Maya...if she thinks someone is coming after her food she WILL swallow the craziest largest pieces. Yesterday when crunching their chicken backs I wanted to grab it & hold it for her while she finished it (because I am paranoid & they are pretty sharp when they get the meat off of them). It was still about 4" across & she tried to swallow it. :roll:

As for the grinds...we did do several of them before. This time I ordered 5lbs of chicken (the pups fav!), 10lbs of pork (another fav), 10lbs of beef for the 5 that can tolerate it (we've not tried this one yet but they'd better love it LOL), 10lbs of turkey (I think we tried this one once before & the pups loved it as well) & then I got 2lbs of rabbit for Mari when the others have the beef. We did try the whole carcass rabbit (fur & all) before & it was also a hit. Mari did once vomit up a hairball though a few hours after eating it. LOL

We have tried the goat for Maribelle & it was one of the "iffy" items. She'd snub it & we'd tough love it thinking maybe the smell was similar to beef - she'd eventually eat it & tolerate it ok except the last time when it did make her throw up. But not as violently as the beef does. I do want to get a bigger tub of that for all the pups next time & I'd also like to try the mutton. Mari isn't typically picky so I do think when she snubs something she knows it will upset her tummy. That's one of the things I'm doing as to not stress myself out...I refuse to have to do the tough love thing so I'm going to try to stick with things I know she can tolerate ok. Hopefully it works! :)

OH & yes...I'd also read that about raw fed dogs being unappealing to fleas--I think that was the deciding factor of not doing the HK again. LOL I mean we'd see one rarely but all it took was a flea bath/comb for everyone & that was that. I pulled 5 off of her & a bunch of "dirt" so we did our regimine & washed/vaccuumed everything & haven't seen any since. So I really chalked it up to the way Mari processes...or doesn't process the fruits & veggies in the HK since she was the main target.

I really didn't expect to get the odor/tearing just from adding in fruits & veggies. It's not horrible but I guess coming from raw before it was bound to happen. I'm sure if we'd been coming from kibble we would have seen a huge improvement. :) OH!! And my goodness...we've still been giving weekly bone in meals. I was telling hubby last night (since yesterday was chicken back day) how AWESOME their breath smells on chicken day. There is NO odor at all! Granted - the only odor they have smells like ZiwiPeak or Honest Kitchen...but the no odor is a bit better. hehe
 

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I hope that nobody feels guilty feeding grinds or pre-mades. Prey model is fabulous and certainly the ideal, but then there is life and sometimes it gets in the way. ha.

I do stella and chewy's dehydrated lamb pre-made a couple times a week at least if I've got a busy schedule. It just makes it so easy to pop out half a patty and crumble it up and feed. I think Brody likes the variety. And yes, it has veggies and fruits so he's getting those in his S&C which is fine. I keep ZiwiPeak in the freezer as well for when we are traveling or I just need something quick.

I really liked Hare-today's grinds when I ordered them before. Now I need to use up what's in the freezer and then order some more. I really liked their turkey hearts I ordered last time. They are about the size of a golf ball and just a big 'ol heart. Such a good and easy meal to pull out of the freezer. I'm out of the tripe grind so need to get that for sure.

I love all the benefits of raw but I think I like the no doggy odor the best. I can hold Brody right up to my nose and inhale and I smell..... nothing at all. Or if he pants in my face, it's just warm breath. There's no odor. I forget how wonderful these things are until I visit my parents dogs who are fed Iams and wooooooooooooo they STINK!!!

Go raw. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Well, I guess I had a somewhat neg experience in one of the big raw boards for feeding grinds. I am not going to feel guilty though because it's the next best thing plus I won't get stressed. LOL

Oh yes, I forgot about the tripe! I love the tripe as well though I wish they had goat tripe or something Mari could better tolerate. I will get some for my other pups though because I think out of everything it's their #1 fav thing as I'm sure it is most pups. ;) We've not tried the turkey hearts. We have gotten the big tub of beef hearts & pork hearts & also the beef trim. I see now they also have a 5lb tub of pork trim as well. Ahhh the varieties they have. LOL

I SO agree about the doggy breath thing. I don't know a dog that has as nice of breath as when my pups are eating raw. It's usually fishy smelling. ICK. And odor. I miss my odor free Chi Chi & am anxious to get them back. LOL Anyway...thanks again for the kind words!
 

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Alright, this thread has unintentionally convinced me to further investigate the ways of Raw.
 

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That's great Heather! Your a wonderful mom, so don't you ever feel guilty!! Got it!? :coolwink:
I know exactly what you mean about preparing, feeding, and cleaning. It's a lot of work! Seriously, a LOT of work! And I only have four!
On the days that I just don't have time or I'm feeling lazy, that's when the Ziwi is feed. ;)
I use the Hare-Today grinds a lot. I love them! No fruits or veggies. Just the essentials!:hello1:
When I place my order I make sure to get the meats that I know I can't find in my local store. That way between the store and Hare-Today they get a good enough variety. IMO.;)
The usual grinds I buy are Goat (meat, bones, organs, & tripe. My guys LOVE goat!), Whole Prey Quail, Whole Prey Rabbit. I love that it has everything they need nutritionally in it! :hello1:
I only buy meaty chicken bones (for the teeth!) and some meaty chunks without the bones at the grocery store. Lamb, pork, beef, turkey are all easy to find. I know that they are already getting all their organs from the Hare-Today grinds and their Ziwi Peak, so I don't have to go on the hunt for a variety of organs.
Not one way is the right way just like Tracy said. I'm know there are raw feeders out there that will not agree with what and how I feed my dogs. I'm sure they would say "No that's all wrong!" Lol! Oh, well. :rolleyes:
I know I am doing the best I can.:D

Oh Yeah, no doggie odor or stinky breath is the best!!!
 

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Draco was doing very well on Raw, then he got sick (I feed him to much liver and it caused a chain reaction of vomiting and not eating) I took him to the vet after 3 days of this because I got scared. Between my husband, who hated feeding raw chicken and the vet who of course really didn't like feeding raw, we went back to the natures variety medallions. Draco eats these with no problems and still gets bits and pieces of raw meat now and again. I know he misses tearing up a chicken thigh. Glad you are getting your crew back on the good stuff.
 

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Draco was doing very well on Raw, then he got sick (I feed him to much liver and it caused a chain reaction of vomiting and not eating) I took him to the vet after 3 days of this because I got scared. Between my husband, who hated feeding raw chicken and the vet who of course really didn't like feeding raw, we went back to the natures variety medallions. Draco eats these with no problems and still gets bits and pieces of raw meat now and again. I know he misses tearing up a chicken thigh. Glad you are getting your crew back on the good stuff.
Aww, sorry Draco got sick. :( We've had a few bouts of things happen with Mari. It is hard to see them like that but it's also a learning process & takes lots of trial & error in getting to know what our pups can & can't tolerate. It can be stressful for sure!


That's great Heather! Your a wonderful mom, so don't you ever feel guilty!! Got it!? :coolwink:
I know exactly what you mean about preparing, feeding, and cleaning. It's a lot of work! Seriously, a LOT of work! And I only have four!
On the days that I just don't have time or I'm feeling lazy, that's when the Ziwi is feed. ;)
I use the Hare-Today grinds a lot. I love them! No fruits or veggies. Just the essentials!:hello1:
When I place my order I make sure to get the meats that I know I can't find in my local store. That way between the store and Hare-Today they get a good enough variety. IMO.;)
The usual grinds I buy are Goat (meat, bones, organs, & tripe. My guys LOVE goat!), Whole Prey Quail, Whole Prey Rabbit. I love that it has everything they need nutritionally in it! :hello1:
I only buy meaty chicken bones (for the teeth!) and some meaty chunks without the bones at the grocery store. Lamb, pork, beef, turkey are all easy to find. I know that they are already getting all their organs from the Hare-Today grinds and their Ziwi Peak, so I don't have to go on the hunt for a variety of organs.
Not one way is the right way just like Tracy said. I'm know there are raw feeders out there that will not agree with what and how I feed my dogs. I'm sure they would say "No that's all wrong!" Lol! Oh, well. :rolleyes:
I know I am doing the best I can.:D

Oh Yeah, no doggie odor or stinky breath is the best!!!
Yeah, I realized quick how "strict" some raw feeders are. I was told I was totally babying my dogs with the grinds & holding bone in meat until my gulpers got the hang of it. Yeah...I'm NOT one to baby my dogs but I wasn't willing to risk them choking. Anyway, I will do my best & I won't feel guilty about it anymore!

I'm pretty anal about getting the right amount of organ in & I was finding it impossible to find organs for Mari to eat. We have chicken livers but nothing else & then even the mixed chicken organ from hare-today was only liver, heart & gizzard. So the grinds are going to be their main sourse of organ. I do have some chicken organ mix left for now & again...probably will use with bone in chicken days. It sounds like we will be doing it very similarly though. I need to again scope out & see what I can find at our grocer & I really would like to get some more chicken necks. The pups really enjoyed them & they are the perfect size for a meal with a bit of added chicken liver/heart/gizzard!



Alright, this thread has unintentionally convinced me to further investigate the ways of Raw.
YAY!! :hello1:
 

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Congrats! It's amazing what a teeny bit of inappropriate food ina daily meal will do to our little carnivores, eh?

I don't really "like" grinds either, but you know what? I'd rather you do ANY raw than none! The processed stuff is just crazy. Hey, maybe one day you can just buy a nice big grinder of your own (Cabellas had NICE ones) and start your own raw making, and even maybe sell it!!

We still grind tripe, because they refuse to eat it otherwise. ;)

Man, wish we could get some of the HareToday stuff! :( Can't even find a site that sells those rabbit ears that ships to Canada.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Congrats! It's amazing what a teeny bit of inappropriate food ina daily meal will do to our little carnivores, eh?

I don't really "like" grinds either, but you know what? I'd rather you do ANY raw than none! The processed stuff is just crazy. Hey, maybe one day you can just buy a nice big grinder of your own (Cabellas had NICE ones) and start your own raw making, and even maybe sell it!!

We still grind tripe, because they refuse to eat it otherwise. ;)

Man, wish we could get some of the HareToday stuff! :( Can't even find a site that sells those rabbit ears that ships to Canada.

You know, we'd talked about making & selling our own "raw". haha We don't quite have the land for that though. Maybe one day! :D And that's what I figure...the grinds are the best we can do right now. Though your pics of your pups eating the quail have made me decide to definitely order some next time around! I actually had them in my cart before I checked out from hare-today but was trying to save a few bucks. Darned it! I did get some of the rabbit ears to try though. I've also scoped out some different places that sell mice, chicks, quite & such as well. It's sort of slim pickin's though but I'd love to add some in. Whole prey, would definitley be convinient because we don't have to worry about getting the right amounts of everything.

Too bad you can't find anyone to ship the rabbit ears to Canada. I really can't believe it!?? Where do you get your whole prey items?
 

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Someone questioned me a while ago when I said dog food is what makes dogs smell can't remember who but it was here anyway proof in the pudding mine have never smelt
 

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Yeah, I expect kibble to make them smell but when it was just the Honest Kitchen (dehydrated raw with fruits & veggies) so I couldn't believe it! My pups are also itching more & I'm sure there is no more flea issue as they've all been frontlined & I've been taking the flea comb to them daily just to be sure & I've found nothing since I first noticed the issue. I'm excited to see if it goes away after we switch back to raw. :)

Gosh, I look at everyone elses dogs I know & their coats are so dull, they stink & have bad breath. My poor best friend has had fleas in her house for years now (they're not dirty people at ALL - have a nice house, etc) & her labs are only 4 and their fur is splotchy & they just look horrible. Makes me feel bad (and frustrated because I can never bring my pups over there!). I've suggested raw more times than I can count & even elaborated & given all the links & info. All I ever get is "yeah, we may have to try that because nothing is working" because one of her labs has TERRIBLE allergies. Granted it will take more than feeding raw to get rid of fleas - her hubby refuses to "bomb" their house. UGH...I couldn't live like that. It would drive me insane! Anyway, that's another topic. But I bet raw would at least help the dogs be less appealing to the fleas in the house. Ah well...what do I know? :roll:
 

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Too bad you can't find anyone to ship the rabbit ears to Canada. I really can't believe it!?? Where do you get your whole prey items?
I know! I would have thought SOMEONE would. :(

I get my mice/rats and quail from two different local breeders, actually. No shipping costs! :)

Also, we get our rabbits at the local market and have to.. ahem... deal with them ourselves. It's cheap though. I usually get a 3-6lb bunny for $3-$5. I've got a few that were 10+ for about $10.
 

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I know! I would have thought SOMEONE would. :(

I get my mice/rats and quail from two different local breeders, actually. No shipping costs! :)

Also, we get our rabbits at the local market and have to.. ahem... deal with them ourselves. It's cheap though. I usually get a 3-6lb bunny for $3-$5. I've got a few that were 10+ for about $10.
Hard core.... I'd vomit
 

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YaY Heather!!!! Good for you! You hit the nail on the head for all the reasons I love RAW!

I took Addy to school with me the other day and a little girl asked if she could pet her. While she was petting her....she leaned in and smelled her....she said..she smells good!!:D Also...living in Florida where fleas thrive in our hot weather....not one single flea since starting RAW...and its been 13 months for us now ;) Ive saved a ton by not having to using Frontline...not to mention the health benefits to my babies.

What is grind? I really need to place an order with Hare Today. Since the weather is cooling....I should be able to save on shipping (not having to ship next day).
 

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:hello1::hello1::hello1:WHOOHOO! RAR RAW RAW... I luv hearing suck great raw stories.
And yours is a good come back :)
I do feed grinds, combined usually with half a chicken neck and is about 1 1/2 ounces for tonka, bungee is a bit less :)
the only thing that i have trouble with is making sure i take it out of the freezer the day before lol!
sardines are a different flavor once n awhile
 

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I know! I would have thought SOMEONE would. :(

I get my mice/rats and quail from two different local breeders, actually. No shipping costs! :)

Also, we get our rabbits at the local market and have to.. ahem... deal with them ourselves. It's cheap though. I usually get a 3-6lb bunny for $3-$5. I've got a few that were 10+ for about $10.
Oh, LUCKY! I think I could handle the small "meal sized" whole carcass meals...not sure about the large bunnies where I'd have to cut up? LOL Maybe I could - I'm a huge animal lover but when it comes to nature & feeding like that it doesn't so much bother me. Still though...the big fluffy bunnies. Not sure. I'd probably stick to pinky rabbits (which I can't find anywhere). I'm definitely ordering some quail chicks next month from hare-today...can't wait!


Hard core.... I'd vomit
LOL...I bet you could do it Sarah. Think of how happy your girls would be! And the way I look at it...a natural prey to Chi's would be the smaller mice/rats/chicks/etc. You'd more likely see them feasting on those animals than cows/pigs/goats/etc. hehe ;) If I had a good source I'd so be feeding that more regularly!


YaY Heather!!!! Good for you! You hit the nail on the head for all the reasons I love RAW!

I took Addy to school with me the other day and a little girl asked if she could pet her. While she was petting her....she leaned in and smelled her....she said..she smells good!!:D Also...living in Florida where fleas thrive in our hot weather....not one single flea since starting RAW...and its been 13 months for us now ;) Ive saved a ton by not having to using Frontline...not to mention the health benefits to my babies.

What is grind? I really need to place an order with Hare Today. Since the weather is cooling....I should be able to save on shipping (not having to ship next day).
Kristy, the grinds are just the ground meat/organ/bone mixes. And YAY for the cooler weather so you can order again! Shipping to here hasn't been more than $25 for the 2 day shipping. I wish we lived locally though - saving that a month would be huge & actually a savings from the ZiwiPeak. LOL Ah well...maybe someday we'll have something local. :D

That's awesome the girl commented on Addy's nice scent. Such a great feeling!!


:hello1::hello1::hello1:WHOOHOO! RAR RAW RAW... I luv hearing suck great raw stories.
And yours is a good come back :)
I do feed grinds, combined usually with half a chicken neck and is about 1 1/2 ounces for tonka, bungee is a bit less :)
the only thing that i have trouble with is making sure i take it out of the freezer the day before lol!
sardines are a different flavor once n awhile

That has been one good thing about NOT doing raw...not having to remember to take things out. LOL But it's not a big deal anyway & I'm usually pretty good at remembering. I'm so anxious to get some chicken necks - I'll have to plan to order some on my vacation next week and make a trip to pick them up. They are a perfect size for a small meal for sure!
 
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