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Discussion Starter #1
To make me a weekly meal plan of a raw diet for Kahlua? Prey-model preferred. We have easy access to most normal meats like chicken, beef, turkey, etc.

I love the idea of raw and have been toying with it for a while but I feel I need a mentor to get me started. I've read so much it just makes my head spin... and I KNOW I'll need to adjust it depending on how her poops are and how she tolerates it. But I'd find it extremely helpful if someone would take the time to write out something for me to follow that is balanced over a week's time. I'd even be willing to pay someone, as I know it's something custom. Lu is 5lbs, and I like to feed 3 meals/day.

Again I know it's a lot to ask but I'd be willing to pay for the service; its just I've done so much research and with my OCD I'd feel more comfortable if someone I trusted would get me started with a feeding guideline. I want whats best for my dog and I'm not ashamed to ask for help when I know I need it!
 

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This is a great idea! I may have to find out who you end up paying to do this, and contact them when I'm ready myself! :)
Good luck with RAW feeding! :D
 

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I would be more than willing to help anyone who wants to try this diet. No pay necessary or accepted!

It's easy. For now, just starting, you will be feeding chicken ONLY for the first 2 weeks. The adjustment period going off kibble and onto prey model is a transition where you use only one protein source until stools are stabilized and the dog is eating well. Then you will gradually add in more proteins and eventually organs over the next few weeks/month.

Can you get cornish hens?

For a 5 pound dog, I would start on 3 ounces a day to make it easy. One ounce per meal, fed 3 times a day.

Get a one pound cornish hen (16 ounces). Thaw it out. Get a sharp knife or a meat cleaver or kitchen scissors. Cut the hen up into 16 pieces, each piece with bone and skin and meat. One ounce is about the size of an ice cube for reference. Stick the pieces in a zip lock in your fridge. Take out one chunk 3 times a day. It doesn't have to be exact. You might feed a smaller piece at breakfast, then a larger one at lunch, then a small one again at dinner. That's OK. Just try to keep it around 3 ounces a day at first.

An alternative plan..... buy a tray of bone-in chicken breasts. Do the same thing. Cut it up into one ounce chunks. Try to get a little bone/skin/meat in each chunk. Dole it out and feed.

Some people start with chicken backs or necks or wings. They are a little too bony for my liking, but some people have great luck with them. This plan has flexibility. There's no "right" or "only" way to do it.

Once you have Kahlua stabilized on chicken... she's eating well, her stools are normal - then we will move you along to another protein. But for now... bone in chicken or cornish hens only.

That's it. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thank. You. O.O We will finish up with our Evo and get grocery shopping. Will keep you updated. Appreciate it so much! =)
 

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If you have ANY questions at all - just let us know. There are several of us here feeding raw, and more all the time, and all of us can contribute and help you out. :)
 

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I also have been reading everything I can find. I have been looking for a "meal plan" as well. I have been usuing RMB's and a lil raw for one meal and kibble (Now! Grain Free Small Breed) for her other meal. I was using the RMB's for her teeth and breath. She was a resue and her teeth and breath were disgusting. After about a week there is VERY lil stuff on her teeth and actually its only on a couple teeth ( her teeth were green and yellow) and now you only smell her breath if she yawns RIGHT in your face.

I have tried to venture out to all raw but I'm scared I will miss something and she will get sick. We have been using chicken necks, chicken wings (altho I was told not to use them cuz I can't get the skin off very well), chicken brest w/o bone and chicken legs. I was thinking of getting tuna in water and adding just a little chunk to her meals, would that be ok?

I will go out and get a Cornish Hen. Lily is 9lbs and I have been giving her 2oz twice a day, although I think I am supposed to be giving her 1.5oz. See? I get way too confused and easily lol The vet said her weight was perfect so I assume I am feeding her enough.
 

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I also have been reading everything I can find. I have been looking for a "meal plan" as well. I have been usuing RMB's and a lil raw for one meal and kibble (Now! Grain Free Small Breed) for her other meal. I was using the RMB's for her teeth and breath. She was a resue and her teeth and breath were disgusting. After about a week there is VERY lil stuff on her teeth and actually its only on a couple teeth ( her teeth were green and yellow) and now you only smell her breath if she yawns RIGHT in your face.

I have tried to venture out to all raw but I'm scared I will miss something and she will get sick. We have been using chicken necks, chicken wings (altho I was told not to use them cuz I can't get the skin off very well), chicken brest w/o bone and chicken legs. I was thinking of getting tuna in water and adding just a little chunk to her meals, would that be ok?

I will go out and get a Cornish Hen. Lily is 9lbs and I have been giving her 2oz twice a day, although I think I am supposed to be giving her 1.5oz. See? I get way too confused and easily lol The vet said her weight was perfect so I assume I am feeding her enough.
Wow!! Awesome!! Sounds like you are off to a great start.

This is one of my favorite raw fed dog's teeth pics. After only ONE week look at the difference. Truly amazing....

RAW diet results!! | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Here is a raw calculator that can help when deciding how much to feed -

Calculate

I like it as a starting point, but some dogs require more or less than the calculator says, so go by your dog's body condition. If they are getting ribby and extra lean, add more meat. If they are looking chunky and you cannot feel ribs easily, then cut back.

I wouldn't recommend tuna, but if you want to add in some canned fish - sardines, mackerel, or salmon are great! I would wait to add in fish though, until you have tried other proteins if you are going to go to a prey model diet. If you just want to supplement with raw, then it's fine to add the fish as an occasional treat. You can also do salmon or fish oil in capsules or a bottle as a nice omega 3 supplement.

There's no reason why you can't do kibble in the morning and raw in the afternoon. Some raw is better than none. As you gain confidence you may want to do more meals of raw and fewer of kibble. Or .... your pup may decide FOR you that she prefers the raw and start refusing her kibble!! ;)
 

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That was the picture I saw and decided to give her some bones and see if it worked, it did! It looks EXACTLY like a pic that would have come from Lily before and after.

How long are sardines good for once I open the can? Can I freeze them? Will one fishie with a meal once or twice a week be ok? Or should I cut it in half with one or two meals a week?

She has had, probably too many meats, but we haven't had any problems. Turkey wings, pork(shoulder roast), chicken, a bite of ground beef. Its usually just a small chunk of meat with her chicken bone and only one kind a week. I keep watching for pork ribs but haven't had any good sales yet and also lamb. When I cook a roast I always take a chunk off before I cook it so she can have a bite with a few of her meals.

I haven't tried any organs yet though. That's where I get Completely lost!

If I leave her on just the foods mentioned above, will she be ok?

I have mixed feelings about the raw/kibble diet. I agree with you about some is better than none and thats usually my outlook as well. Then I sit here and think what's the point of trying to better for her if im just going to keep giving her kibble too. But on the other hand, if I give her raw for breakfast, kibble for supper is alot easier to cart around if we are not going to be home. Also if we go away for a day or two and have to give her kibble she will be used to it and wont upset her. I guess as long as I give her a GOOD kibble, all will be ok. Which leads to another question(sorry)... If I decide to keep one meal kibble, do I still need the organs or will she get the "rest" from the kibble?

Sorry for SOOO many questions.
 

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That was the picture I saw and decided to give her some bones and see if it worked, it did!

How long are sardines good for once I open the can? Can I freeze them? Will one fishie with a meal once or twice a week be ok? Or should I cut it in half with one or two meals a week?

She has had, probably too many meats, but we haven't had any problems. Turkey wings, pork(shoulder roast), chicken, a bite of ground beef. Its usually just a small chunk of meat with her chicken bone and only one kind a week. I keep watching for pork ribs but haven't had any good sales yet and also lamb. When I cook a roast I always take a chunk off before I cook it so she can have a bite with a few of her meals.

I haven't tried any organs yet though. That's where I get Completely lost!

If I leave her on just the foods mentioned above, will she be ok?

I have mixed feelings about the raw/kibble diet. I agree with you about some is better than none and thats usually my outlook as well. Then I sit here and think what's the point of trying to better for her if im just going to keep giving her kibble too. But on the other hand, if I give her raw for breakfast, kibble for supper is alot easier to cart around if we are not going to be home. Also if we go away for a day or two and have to give her kibble she will be used to it and wont upset her. I guess as long as I give her a GOOD kibble, all will be ok. Which leads to another question(sorry)... If I decide to keep one meal kibble, do I still need the organs or will she get the "rest" from the kibble?

Sorry for SOOO many questions.
No problem. Ask away.

Sardines can be frozen. I get the ones packed in water. There are usually 3 of them. The can weighs 4 ounces. So I give 1.5 fish as a meal. Freeze the other 1.5 for later. Easy. If you just want to give them as a supplement with a meal - that's fine too. Just dole them out how you wish and freeze the rest.

Be aware that anytime you add in different proteins there may be a temporary bowel upset. Don't stress over it. If you have recurrent loose stools or 'cannon butt' with excessive diarrhea, you can fix it by adding in a bone heavy meal like a chicken neck or wing. Bone acts as fiber and firms up stools.

Sounds like she's tried a lot of variety! That's great. NO problems.

I understand your kibble/raw dilema. I have a proposition for you. Why not go off of kibble and onto dehydrated or frozen raw? It's easy. It's already pre-packaged, no weighing, no measuring. It's balanced - no wondering if you have the organ or bone percentages right. It's all there and it's RAW, just in a dehydrated or frozen form. ;)

Stella and Chewy's is my favorite of the premade raws. Bravo and Primal are also good. Nature's Variety has been around the longest, but has had a recall so I'm leery of using them. I use Stella and Chewy's a couple times a week, if I'm busy or we are traveling. It's just a little dried patty that weighs 2 ounces. I break it in half, crumble up, and feed. Simple and easy. Just as easy as kibble. And the benefits of raw. The best of both worlds.

There is also another couple of options I'll throw out for you. (NOT trying to confuse you, but just to give you some other ideas on ways to incorporate a healthy diet). ZiwiPeak is an EXCELLENT food. It is a dehydrated raw that comes in a bag, just like kibble. It is small jerky type squares. Most dogs really love the taste. It's fantastic. I always keep some on hand for when I need a quick meal. Great for traveling or boarding.

I thought I'd mention The Honest Kitchen as well. I don't feed this so don't know much about it, but if you do a search here you will find tons of info. It's a mix that you add water to and make a gruel. You can feed it by itself or add in meats, either raw or cooked.

Have I confused you???? Hope not. :)
 

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Nope, you didn't confuse me!

I have looked at all the pre made raws I can get in my area, they are very expencive. I have read about the ones you have metioned as well, on this forum and through google searches. I am rather enjoying "prepairing" her meals.

I really believe that once I "get going" with the raw it will be easy peasy, just like grabbing a scoop of kibble and plopping it in her bowl. If I take a couple hours, I can get a couple weeks of food set up for her so all I'll have to do is "plop it in her dish" I am a SAHM so I time usually isn't an issue for me.

I also like the idea of her having everything that we would eat. It's like sneaking her table foods without the sneaking hehe

Does the cornish hens have the organs in them still, the ones I would get at the grocery store? If so, I can just cut that up and it will be a balanced diet?

Oh and kinda off topic.. I was always amazed with how some of the dogs would stay in their "spot" to eat. At first Lily tried to go bury her food in my furniture. I kept putting her back and she finally has gotten it! As soon as I lay her "eating blanket" out she sits on it and waits for her food and stays on it to eat. I don't even have to sit beside her anymore.


Thanks for all the answers and being patient.. And I'm sure I will have lots more questions.
 

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Nope, you didn't confuse me!

I have looked at all the pre made raws I can get in my area, they are very expencive. I have read about the ones you have metioned as well, on this forum and through google searches. I am rather enjoying "prepairing" her meals.

I really believe that once I "get going" with the raw it will be easy peasy, just like grabbing a scoop of kibble and plopping it in her bowl. If I take a couple hours, I can get a couple weeks of food set up for her so all I'll have to do is "plop it in her dish" I am a SAHM so I time usually isn't an issue for me.

I also like the idea of her having everything that we would eat. It's like sneaking her table foods without the sneaking hehe

Does the cornish hens have the organs in them still, the ones I would get at the grocery store? If so, I can just cut that up and it will be a balanced diet?

Oh and kinda off topic.. I was always amazed with how some of the dogs would stay in their "spot" to eat. At first Lily tried to go bury her food in my furniture. I kept putting her back and she finally has gotten it! As soon as I lay her "eating blanket" out she sits on it and waits for her food and stays on it to eat. I don't even have to sit beside her anymore.


Thanks for all the answers and being patient.. And I'm sure I will have lots more questions.
Yes, the pre-mades are expensive. But for someone wanting to do raw, but unsure about it - they are a great alternative.

Cornish hens don't have organs inside of them. They do have the kidneys still stuck next to the backbone though, and so yes - they would count as organ.

If you DO decide to go all raw, then yes - you will have to incorporate organs into the diet and you will also need to add in some variety. Just feeding through cornish hens is NOT balanced unfortunately. It's easy, but not that easy. ha.

First off - a raw diet is 80% meat. A cornish hen is about 35% bone, so not enough meat. It's fine to use them, just add some meaty meals in between the bone-in meals. I like to strive for about 70% red meat. Red meats have a denser nutrient base than poultry. They are also fattier, and fat is essential in a diet. Since we aren't using carbs at all, fat acts as the energy source. Poultry is lean, that's why I like using it for bone content - but I do meat meals for in between (beef, pork, lamb, bison, goat, venison).

Since Lily has had a lot of variety already, you could certainly pre-package up some meals for her and have them ready to throw in a bowl. Your ratios will be 80% meat, 10% bone, and 10% organs. You don't have to feed this every meal - it is balance over time.

For some good examples of sample meals, go to the 'what's your menu' thread here and scroll through what the raw feeders here are feeding on a daily and weekly basis ....

http://www.chihuahua-people.com/raw-food/54026-whats-your-menu-today-raw-fed.html

That will help you give you an idea of the variety that we incorporate. I do organs as a meal on the weekend. I use beef or calf liver and beef or pork kidney. An ounce of each on Saturday and again on Sunday. That satisfies his organ requirement. Some dogs can tolerate an entire meal of organs. Some can't. A case of knowing your dog.

And yes, I know how satisfying it is to prepare your dogs meals. It just feels good to know that you are giving them food that you would feed your family instead of processed cereal in a bag that has a shelf life of years. I think that once you get going - you will really love it and wonder how you ever did kibble. ;)
 

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Oh how exciting!!!! I love people who want to know about raw!!!

It sounds confusing working out the ratios and stuff I promise you it's not!!!! There are no stupid questions at all
 

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I was overwhelmed at first with trying to figure everything out switching my dogs to raw, but it's really simple if you think about it, I feed 80% meat, 10% bone, 5% liver & 5% other organ (kidneys at the moment), I feed organs twice a week with a bone in meal that works for Zoey. I also cut up the meats as I get them, weigh them separate into baggies and then every 2-3 days pull meat from the freezer so it can defrost in the fridge. That works well. I have just started feeding my 4 & 1/2 month old Min Pin (whom I just got) raw and she's my first puppy on raw, and I'm just amazed at how well she's doing.
 

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I like the poos :tard:

Yesterday I gave her both kibble meals and this morning her poo was twice the size as I was getting with one kibble and one raw meal.
 

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I like the poos :tard:

Yesterday I gave her both kibble meals and this morning her poo was twice the size as I was getting with one kibble and one raw meal.
ha ha! Oh yeah, we raw feeders love our dogs tiny poops. :) Of course it's great because it's so small and easy to pick up, or to let disintegrate in the yard. (Brody's are completely gone after a rain). But the best part???? The way their bodies assimilate and process a biologically appropriate food. There is very little waste because their bodies use what is in the food so completely and efficiently. I love that.
 

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Alright, i've got my fill of this thread. My bf and I are getting back on the healthy bandwagon this week with the gym and our diet, organic natural etc and i'm very much leaning toward the dogs getting on the train too!

It is a little confusing, I understand the hens for a few weeks, that I get but i'll admit i'm pretty, well, inexperienced in cutting up and rationing meats. I usually do boneless skinless everything but i'm willing to try assuming my bf agrees to the transition. Also, if no one minds, about how much do you spend on your raw meals/week and is there a way to prepare in advance and "preserve," my bf has a hard time putting kibble in the bowl twice a day let alone chopping something up and rationing it.

So in the big picture, i'm a little confused, i'll need meats bones and organs that I get but say, I get comfortable and my dogs enjoy chicken wings and some organ something or another, is it detrimental to keep them on a steady diet of the same protien as long as I meet the 80/10/10 ratio? I guess that sounds a little silly as it doesn't sound like anything is worse than kibble!

I guess i'm mainly considering this because what I feed now is Eukanuba, not the best I know but my girl has had so many tummy troubles I just stuck with what didn't upset her, she's a "chronic poop eater!" and I read where Mchis pup started doing that on kibble, I wonder if mine would quit if I stopped kibble.

I didn't mean to barge in on the thread but this is exactly what I needed. I've read and read and read through pages and my head is swimming, but i'm a visual learner more than anything I suppose, if I can visually see what I need to do it'll get done.

Long winded as always, I apologize!
 

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Yep, start with hens or bone-in chicken breasts for at least a week and probably two. Once they are assimilated on chicken, eating well, and pooping well - then you can move onto another protein.

I would discourage anyone considering a raw diet to do chicken only. That's not balanced. You must have variety and I prefer mostly red meats. Their nutrient base is denser than white meats. Of course you don't have to feed a filet mignon steak!!! Look for cheap cuts... roasts on sale, etc. I especially like beef heart as a staple. It's about the meatiest red meat you can get and packed full of vitamins/minerals. One beef heart lasts a LONG time and they aren't that expensive. Beef cheekmeat is another example of a cheaper type of beef, also beef tongue. Some of these cuts can be found very inexpensively at ethnic markets so check them out in your city.

If you have access to farmers or hunters - they are a great source of meats. If you know of anyone cleaning out their freezer for the hunting season, or just getting rid of old freezer burned meats - you can feed that! Ask around. Network.

Once you start meat hunting - be sure and look for unenhanced meats. Read labels. Watch the sodium, you want meats that are not tenderized or have added plumping solutions. Sodium must be 100mg or less per serving, 4 ounces.

A 5 pound dog typically eats 2-3 ounces a day. Maybe a little more if they are a puppy or have a high metabolism. That is about the size of 3 ice cubes. Not very much food at all. I buy Brody's meats when I get ours at the grocery store and haven't noticed any increase in our food bills at all. The only time I notice it is if I buy him some custom grinds from hare-today.com or similar or if I buy a bag of pre-made raw. Example - we are having a pork roast for dinner.... I cut off a 2 ounce chunk before I throw it in the crock pot. That's Brody's dinner. Or we are having chicken for dinner - I pull off the wings and there's several meals for him.

You will add in organs later on, after a month or so.

Any questions? Ask away! We will help you. :)
 

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Oh hmm, I didn't think of it that simply just cutting off a few chunks for the pups, we're trying to cut back anyway in dieting and with just 2 of us prepackaged meats are always too much.

That was a question I forgot, Godric is only 15 weeks, is it okay for him to have raw? I'm worried about him choking himself on a bone or something, he INHALES his kibble. I've NEVER seen a dog get that excited over something so repulsive to me, he hops around whenever I get the bag it's like puppy crack!

One other thing, i'm only available to feed them twice a day, I keep seeing 3 meals a day, it's not going to mess it up if I do 2 right?

Thank you again, Brody is so beautiful I hope my pups can look that way. My girl needs to slim down a little and her coat isn't particularly shiny/smooth and I know nutrition is the key.
 

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Yes, you can do raw with puppies. Sarah is feeding a puppy as is Heather. They are doing great with them. Some people wean their brand new pups right onto raw. They have no problem adjusting at all.

And you're right about kibble being like doggy crack! It's sprayed with a flavor enhancer (fat) so that it tastes good. Think McDonalds for dogs.

I would think you could two bigger meals, rather than 3 smaller ones. 15 weeks is almost 4 months. Raw fed puppies grow slowly and steadily with no acute weight gains and they rarely go through a gangly, ugly stage. They just grow to their potential without all the extra roly poly pudge of kibble fed puppies.

When you start Godric, you may want to start with something you can hold onto such as a chicken leg or chicken wing and let him gnaw on it on your lap on a towel. I used to do that for Brody in order to teach him how to eat. Some raw purists frown on that method, thinking that a dog should know how to eat - but you do what is right for you and makes you feel comfortable. I know that Heather (Mchis) started her pups out on chicken necks and they all did fine.

Thanks for the compliments on Brody. We get comments wherever we go on his shiny coat and his condition. :) I'm just glad to know that I'm feeding him a species appropriate diet and that he is thriving on it.
 

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Oh hmm, I didn't think of it that simply just cutting off a few chunks for the pups, we're trying to cut back anyway in dieting and with just 2 of us prepackaged meats are always too much.

That was a question I forgot, Godric is only 15 weeks, is it okay for him to have raw? I'm worried about him choking himself on a bone or something, he INHALES his kibble. I've NEVER seen a dog get that excited over something so repulsive to me, he hops around whenever I get the bag it's like puppy crack!

One other thing, i'm only available to feed them twice a day, I keep seeing 3 meals a day, it's not going to mess it up if I do 2 right?

Thank you again, Brody is so beautiful I hope my pups can look that way. My girl needs to slim down a little and her coat isn't particularly shiny/smooth and I know nutrition is the key.
I am feeding a puppy (4 & 1/2 months old) raw (she's a Miniature Pinscher and about the same size as a chi might be) and she is doing awesome. I'm uploading some Videos to youtube of Zoey & Ziva eating raw and will post them so you can see how 'easily' they eat. Ziva has only adult molar teeth, her fangs/k9's and incisors are still puppy teeth. Zoey used to literally INHALE her kibble it was like 1 second it was all gone, it took her 10 minutes to eat her dinner tonight....MUCH better. Zoey is eating 2 meals a day, Ziva was getting 4 but we thought she was only 3 months old, she's older so I am probably going to cut her back to 3 for the next few months. You will LOVE what Raw will do for your dogs. Zoey is doing amazingly well on it.
 
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